Match Day - England v Scotland - 18/06/2021 - KO:20:00 - Group D -

giro

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My point is that every England supporter I associate with arrogantly believes they should be winning this tournament and also believed they would annihilate Scotland yesterday. Not sure what you can't understand. 🤷‍♂️
I can only assume you haven’t met too many England supporters.
The vast majorities opinion is, hopeful, with a large dollop of pessimism.
Tarring all England fans as arrogant, is rather lazy.
 

Mer5eywhite

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I'm not an England hater, but I do react in accordance with the level of shit I receive. When I was at high school for example during Euro 96, I got a world of shit when England beat Scotland. It was incessant for days. It therefore drove me to form some Germanic tendencies towards the end of that tournament.
I was brought up to get behind the British and Irish teams but that ended long ago. Believe me it comes back the other way. It’s stopped me supporting the any of the home countries to be fair, including Ireland. even though I have plenty of Irish mates.
 

JohnPNE

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Then I’d find a few supporters who aren’t blindingly drunk or havent taken hallucinogenic drugs
Most I know where surprised we even qualified and certainly weren’t surprised at last nights utter rubbish

Surprised we qualified? We go from people who are over the top optimistic to people who are over the top pessimistic.

Who are these people who are surprised we qualified. They mustn’t be positive at all.
 

Ando60

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Surprised we qualified? We go from people who are over the top optimistic to people who are over the top pessimistic.

Who are these people who are surprised we qualified. They mustn’t be positive at all.
Even I knew that we would qualify and I can be a tad pessimistic sometimes….
 

Henry Weston

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Kane isn't shit. His insane goals record at club and international level tells you that. He just plays in a shit Spurs side. I agree though that he's not in form. Looks jaded. I think if he gets a move to a City or United he will score 30-35 goals next season.

7th top scorer in Premier League history and he's still only 27.
You’re right, he isn’t shit he’s actually very good. He is not imho,however, world class as many in the media seem to suggest. Nor are any other England players. In fact I’m struggling to think of the last one that could genuinely be classified as world class, again despite what the media hype might tell us.
 

HunterLionheart

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You’re right, he isn’t shit he’s actually very good. He is not imho,however, world class as many in the media seem to suggest. Nor are any other England players. In fact I’m struggling to think of the last one that could genuinely be classified as world class, again despite what the media hype might tell us.

How do you define world class? We have multiple players who are integral to champions league and Premier league winning teams.

If you want to say just Messi and Ronaldo and Mbappe, that's fine, but it becomes a pretty worthless descriptor in that case.
 

JohnPNE

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You’re right, he isn’t shit he’s actually very good. He is not imho,however, world class as many in the media seem to suggest. Nor are any other England players. In fact I’m struggling to think of the last one that could genuinely be classified as world class, again despite what the media hype might tell us.

What defines someone as world class? Genuine question.

For me, players like Aguero, suarez, shearer, Henry etc were/are world class players and I would count Kane as good as them.

But as Hunter says: Ronaldo and messi are better than the rest so if they are what you define as what you need to do to be ‘world class.’ then there is not going to be many world class players in the world.

I agree with the rest. I can’t think of the last genuine ‘world class’ player apart from Kane. Rooney maybe. But apart from 2004 never really did it in a tournament for England. I always think he let England down - getting sent off for stupid things and shouting into a camera after a drab 0-0 draw v Algeria. Foden has the potential if he keeps on improving plus Bellingham. I always think of how good Jack Wilshere could have been if injuries hadn’t fucked him over. Someone like Alex Arnold and Reece James too. But apart from that can’t think of any more.
 

Henry Weston

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How do you define world class? We have multiple players who are integral to champions league and Premier league winning teams.

If you want to say just Messi and Ronaldo and Mbappe, that's fine, but it becomes a pretty worthless descriptor in that case.
They’re obviously world class as are the likes of Aguero, Iniesta, David Villa, Lewandoski and many others. What I’m saying is that the likes of Harry Kane and the rest of the current English generation are not on the same level. Just my opinion as to how I’d personally classify “world class”.
 

Henry Weston

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What defines someone as world class? Genuine question.

For me, players like Aguero, suarez, shearer, Henry etc were/are world class players and I would count Kane as good as them.

But as Hunter says: Ronaldo and messi are better than the rest so if they are what you define as what you need to do to be ‘world class.’ then there is not going to be many world class players in the world.

I agree with the rest. I can’t think of the last genuine ‘world class’ player apart from Kane. Rooney maybe. But apart from 2004 never really did it in a tournament for England. I always think he let England down - getting sent off for stupid things and shouting into a camera after a drab 0-0 draw v Algeria. Foden has the potential if he keeps on improving plus Bellingham. I always think of how good Jack Wilshere could have been if injuries hadn’t fucked him over. Someone like Alex Arnold and Reece James too. But apart from that can’t think of any more.
I honestly couldn’t classify Kane as good as any of those strikears you mention, John. Again obviously just my opinion and I appreciate others will have a different one.
 

HunterLionheart

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They’re obviously world class as are the likes of Aguero, Iniesta, David Villa, Lewandoski and many others. What I’m saying is that the likes of Harry Kane and the rest of the current English generation are not on the same level. Just my opinion as to how I’d personally classify “world class”.

Of the 4 you mentioned, only Lewa is world class right now.

I don't really understand how the best striker in the Premier league can't be considered world class? Mason Mount and Reece James are integral parts of the winners of the Champions League, are they not world class in their positions? Sterling has been integral and outstanding for City for years. Whilst Foden is stepping into that same catagory this season.

They're all elite players, that's why they're playing at the level they are. Doesn't mean they can't ever have poor games or be held back by coaching.
 
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