Northern to lose franchise

John T

Advisor to the Owner
The intercity trains are usually on time, theyre rarely a problem.
Well raefil
If that is so
All I can say is they must go a 'hell of a lot faster' somewhere else

And if you are right, what is the real reason for all that investment in HS2 I wonder?
Was it really the extra 20-30 minutes thing?
'Hell of a lot of money' to spend for just that
And that was supported by Labour as well as the Tories
 

raefil

Shit Fan
Patron
Well raefil
If that is so
All I can say is they must go a 'hell of a lot faster' somewhere else

And if you are right, what is the real reason for all that investment in HS2 I wonder?
Was it really the extra 20-30 minutes thing?
'Hell of a lot of money' to spend for just that
And that was supported by Labour as well as the Tories
No stats for Avanti yet, as theyve just taken over.

Virgin Trains is celebrating a five star rating for reliability in the latest Annual Passenger Survey from Which? today. Customers of Virgin Trains on the west coast are also experiencing record punctuality as a result of a combined effort between the rail operator and Network Rail to identify and resolve the cause of delays on the route. 88.3% of trains arrived on time over the last twelve months, an improvement of eight percentage points since comparable records began just after privatisation, two decades ago*.

This has resulted in eight months of strong performance – with PPM (punctuality) figures of over 90% - and a significant reduction in ‘bad days’.

Virgin Trains and Network Rail first started working together in this way in 2009, leading to a series of improvements being made on the west coast main line each year. However, in the last 18 months, the two companies have shifted their focus to the basics of railway operation and infrastructure maintenance and as a result the benefits of the working group have now been realised.

These combined efforts have seen 100 days with a PPM of 90% or above in the past six months. That compares with 58 days in the same period two years ago. In addition, the last period has seen over 45% of trains arrive at their destinations early. **
 

John T

Advisor to the Owner
No stats for Avanti yet, as theyve just taken over.

Virgin Trains is celebrating a five star rating for reliability in the latest Annual Passenger Survey from Which? today. Customers of Virgin Trains on the west coast are also experiencing record punctuality as a result of a combined effort between the rail operator and Network Rail to identify and resolve the cause of delays on the route. 88.3% of trains arrived on time over the last twelve months, an improvement of eight percentage points since comparable records began just after privatisation, two decades ago*.

This has resulted in eight months of strong performance – with PPM (punctuality) figures of over 90% - and a significant reduction in ‘bad days’.

Virgin Trains and Network Rail first started working together in this way in 2009, leading to a series of improvements being made on the west coast main line each year. However, in the last 18 months, the two companies have shifted their focus to the basics of railway operation and infrastructure maintenance and as a result the benefits of the working group have now been realised.

These combined efforts have seen 100 days with a PPM of 90% or above in the past six months. That compares with 58 days in the same period two years ago. In addition, the last period has seen over 45% of trains arrive at their destinations early. **
Well thank you for all that raefil
But you don't really answer my question, even more so with these figures
Why the 'Hell do we need HS2' and all the money involved
 

raefil

Shit Fan
Patron
Well thank you for all that raefil
But you don't really answer my question, even more so with these figures
Why the 'Hell do we need HS2' and all the money involved
Nice attempt at deflecting away, once again, from your utter ignorance. If you want to chat HS2 I believe peoples views, including mine, Have been expressed many times on here. The general concensus appeared to be that the costs would be better spent on improving transport infrastructure in the UK.

I know you dont do facts and truths but perhaps have a little read before you start throwing your bigotry and ignorance around on a subject that you havent a clue about.
 

Liberation

Forum Patron
Patron
Well thank you for all that raefil
But you don't really answer my question, even more so with these figures
Why the 'Hell do we need HS2' and all the money involved

" We " don't is the simple answer to that one and I doubt that you'll find many that disagree............ There's money to be made via this bloody charade and it won't benefit the likes of me and thee.. I'd pull the plug tomorrow and so should Boris....
 

John T

Advisor to the Owner
" We " don't is the simple answer to that one and I doubt that you'll find many that disagree............ There's money to be made via this bloody charade and it won't benefit the likes of me and thee.. I'd pull the plug tomorrow and so should Boris....
Thank you for that LIb
Add me to your list

As for Raefil
Again as is his is usual response 'insult is all'
I haven’t the time or inclination to spend hours rooting through facts and figures
But I know what I see locally on the Railway Lines, and it seem to me much more could be done to make the service better, by clearing the 'chokepoint' I refereed too , rather than spending (reportedly 108 Billion up again I see) on HS2
I do wonder what the final bill will be

Still that’s only a ‘normal’ posters view not a political hacks one
 

PNEESSEX

Forum Patron
Patron
Thank you for that LIb
Add me to your list

As for Raefil
Again as is his is usual response 'insult is all'
I haven’t the time or inclination to spend hours rooting through facts and figures
But I know what I see locally on the Railway Lines, and it seem to me much more could be done to make the service better, by clearing the 'chokepoint' I refereed too , rather than spending (reportedly 108 Billion up again I see) on HS2
I do wonder what the final bill will be

Still that’s only a ‘normal’ posters view not a political hacks one
One of the purposes of HS2 is to create more capacity. It's bugger all about getting to Birmingham 20 minutes quicker.
 

John T

Advisor to the Owner
One of the purposes of HS2 is to create more capacity. It's bugger all about getting to Birmingham 20 minutes quicker.
I would suggest the 20 minutes was the original, at least that was being what was suggested at first according to my recollection

Not sure what is meant by capacity? Have we not enough intercity trains to cope?

And in a few years travel for business reasons won’t be the same problem as the Internet becomes more and more efficient and faster. I have friend (yes I do have some) who’s Son used to travel down regularly for meetings, now does most of it from home.

Saves his Company paying the fares and the overnight expenses, and see’s his young family more too
What's not to like?
 

PNEESSEX

Forum Patron
Patron
I would suggest the 20 minutes was the original, at least that was being what was suggested at first according to my recollection

Not sure what is meant by capacity? Have we not enough intercity trains to cope?

And in a few years travel for business reasons won’t be the same problem as the Internet becomes more and more efficient and faster. I have friend (yes I do have some) who’s Son used to travel down regularly for meetings, now does most of it from home.

Saves his Company paying the fares and the overnight expenses, and see’s his young family more too
What's not to like?
Capacity in this context is more rail tracks, therefore more trains can be run.. That means more passenger services and more freight which surely has to be a good thing
 

jakehake

Preachs PA
Staff member
Patron
I would suggest the 20 minutes was the original, at least that was being what was suggested at first according to my recollection

Not sure what is meant by capacity? Have we not enough intercity trains to cope?

And in a few years travel for business reasons won’t be the same problem as the Internet becomes more and more efficient and faster. I have friend (yes I do have some) who’s Son used to travel down regularly for meetings, now does most of it from home.

Saves his Company paying the fares and the overnight expenses, and see’s his young family more too
What's not to like?

The stats don't back it up though. Rail usage has been increasing year on year (almost exponentially in recent years) even though technology has come on in leaps and bounds. That's why there is a need for additional capacity. Also to hit climate targets I believe that they need to move freight of the roads and that can only really go back onto rail ultimately

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sliper

Forum Patron
Patron
For a lot less we could build the worlds first full operational London Manchester hyperloop.. it could be made to run in tunnels and be cleaner and faster than planes.

Ground breaking 21st technology for the region that lead the world into the railway age.

 
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jakehake

Preachs PA
Staff member
Patron
For a lot less you could build a London Manchester hyperloop.. it would run mainly be in tunnels and be at faster speeds than planes.

Ground breaking 21st technology for the region that lead the world into the railway age.

Isn't capacity still the biggest issue for hyperloops as they can't do the same volumes as high speed overground though? Ultimately speed will increase the required usage so it then stifles itself in tehory
 

sliper

Forum Patron
Patron
Isn't capacity still the biggest issue for hyperloops as they can't do the same volumes as high speed overground though? Ultimately speed will increase the required usage so it then stifles itself in tehory
There are few limits to the number of tunnels that could link Manchester to London... so capacity isn't limited.
Plus hyperloop pods could leave every five minutes... and be computer controlled to prevent collisions

Elon Musk says he has brought the cost of tunnelling down to $10 million per mile and that will probably reduce further on major distance projects. He is currently drilling parallel one mile tunnels in Las Vegas and says it will be fully operational a year from now. Upscale that with multiple machines and you have the makings of a UK hyperloop. Edinburgh London is one of the proposed routes in the video.

He projected the cost of a LA to SF hyperloop (350 miles) at $6 billion... double that for tunnelling and it is still massively less than HS2

Plus no landowners to buy off and environmentalists to object. The whole system has no impact on the surface.

The video shows an above ground system but it would probably work better below ground.
 
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John T

Advisor to the Owner
Capacity in this context is more rail tracks, therefore more trains can be run.. That means more passenger services and more freight which surely has to be a good thing
Well you are beginning to lose me there Essex

Not sure I would want Goods trains to run at the speed they are planning for HS2, and as far as I am aware HS2 is to run on totally different tracks to the normal system, I admit I might be wrong on that as the plans seem to change like the weather

And as I pointed out on the post I would expect Business with the advent of better/faster technology, the tendency will be to do more stuff online, thus avoiding the cost of travel and the inevitable cost of overnight accommodation
 

PNEESSEX

Forum Patron
Patron
Well you are beginning to lose me there Essex

Not sure I would want Goods trains to run at the speed they are planning for HS2, and as far as I am aware HS2 is to run on totally different tracks to the normal system, I admit I might be wrong on that as the plans seem to change like the weather

And as I pointed out on the post I would expect Business with the advent of better/faster technology, the tendency will be to do more stuff online, thus avoiding the cost of travel and the inevitable cost of overnight accommodation
HS2 tracks will take trains off the main network, hence increased capacity
 

John T

Advisor to the Owner
HS2 tracks will take trains off the main network, hence increased capacity
Ha I see, so in reality as reafil says the Intercity Trains run near enough on time (and he is NEVER wrong is he?) it IS all about the 20 minute thing after all

But interestingly you don’t answer my point on Technology and the Internet and the fact that could l ‘do away’ with a large part of the need for Business travel

Be interested to hear you views on that?
 

PNEESSEX

Forum Patron
Patron
Ha I see, so in reality as reafil says the Intercity Trains run near enough on time (and he is NEVER wrong is he?) it IS all about the 20 minute thing after all

But interestingly you don’t answer my point on Technology and the Internet and the fact that could l ‘do away’ with a large part of the need for Business travel

Be interested to hear you views on that?
Business travel will always be necessary, even if technology makes it less important. What would be a good outcome would be to take more people and more freight off the roads and the HS2 supporters claim that is a key outcome. I was very sceptical about it until I had a very lengthy conversation, over a very long lunch , with an old friend of mine who knows this stuff like the back of his hand. He convinced me that HS2 is an essential infrastructure upgrade. That's the benefit of listening to experts....
 
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