UK Energy Crisis

Sepp Blatter

Liz Truss Groupie
Patron
so well they suspended a presenter for his right to take the knee.

Was not a fan of that, to be honest.

As I said, I tend to follow particular interviewers/presenters I like - and they have excellent discussions and guests talking about these issues.
 

KeithLard

Forum Patron
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If its gone too far right for its creator Andrew neil then, without any doubt at all, it will be way too far right for me.

I am all too aware that populism works, for some, but not for me.
It really isn't far right at all. Not even close. Yes I know Farage has a slot on there but he's tarnished before he even says anything thanks to the mainstream medias version of him and him playing up to it.

The rest of the content I've seen mainly in the early evening and before midnight is really good and completely different to the nonsense on BBC and Sky
 

raefil

Dolly Patron
Patron
It really isn't far right at all. Not even close. Yes I know Farage has a slot on there but he's tarnished before he even says anything thanks to the mainstream medias version of him and him playing up to it.

The rest of the content I've seen mainly in the early evening and before midnight is really good and completely different to the nonsense on BBC and Sky
In fairness i dont watch bbc news or sky news either!
 
OP
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jakehake

Preachs PA
Staff member
Patron
Interesting suggestion in this article by Morgan from the LibDem about a “Government provider of last resort”. Wonder if it could have worked

If the Government had a utility provider that was there to mop up all the failed company customers, could only offer a single tariff based around their own set price caps so wasn’t there to compete like the others, just provide a service. At least people could then choose again if they’d rather just stay slow and steady and pay more or leave again for a “commercial” company with a cheaper tariff.

If it did make profits based on being able to source energy for cheaper than the price caps then that could be used for either subsidies or for helping those affected by fuel poverty(or used as a buffer to cope with when prices spike again and retained only for those purposes above.)

I know that’s basically a Nationalised power company again but if we’re spending £2.1bn to keep Bulb going then what’s the difference?

UK government sets aside £1.7bn to support Bulb customers https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59409595
 

pnewortham

Forum Patron
Patron
Interesting suggestion in this article by Morgan from the LibDem about a “Government provider of last resort”. Wonder if it could have worked

If the Government had a utility provider that was there to mop up all the failed company customers, could only offer a single tariff based around their own set price caps so wasn’t there to compete like the others, just provide a service. At least people could then choose again if they’d rather just stay slow and steady and pay more or leave again for a “commercial” company with a cheaper tariff.

If it did make profits based on being able to source energy for cheaper than the price caps then that could be used for either subsidies or for helping those affected by fuel poverty(or used as a buffer to cope with when prices spike again and retained only for those purposes above.)

I know that’s basically a Nationalised power company again but if we’re spending £2.1bn to keep Bulb going then what’s the difference?

UK government sets aside £1.7bn to support Bulb customers https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59409595

It's obviously just the sheer size of Bulb, but the gov were very clear about not bailing out the smaller companies. So is this one a pang of conscience or just the logistical (im)practicalities of dumping 1.7M customers onto other suppliers.
 
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jakehake

Preachs PA
Staff member
Patron
It's obviously just the sheer size of Bulb, but the gov were very clear about not bailing out the smaller companies. So is this one a pang of conscience or just the logistical (im)practicalities of dumping 1.7M customers onto other suppliers.

I'll presume it's the latter in terms of how you can slice and dice so many customers without causing issues for the recipient companies but I guess the real test will be if Bulb is run to try and carry on as a corporate entity or sustained to allow them to "force" a move on the customers over the next year into other suppliers.

As you say the smaller companies were left to rot. Given they always go to great pains to say that no one would be left without gas or electric they obviously know they have ways and means they can make it work, in 3 weeks in September it was over 2m customers affected across 5 or 6 companies but shows it was still a similar number of customers to what we have now being affected.
 

pnewortham

Forum Patron
Patron
I'll presume it's the latter in terms of how you can slice and dice so many customers without causing issues for the recipient companies but I guess the real test will be if Bulb is run to try and carry on as a corporate entity or sustained to allow them to "force" a move on the customers over the next year into other suppliers.

As you say the smaller companies were left to rot. Given they always go to great pains to say that no one would be left without gas or electric they obviously know they have ways and means they can make it work, in 3 weeks in September it was over 2m customers affected across 5 or 6 companies but shows it was still a similar number of customers to what we have now being affected.
The wholesale market seems to have peaked now so I wonder if there's a bit more chance of Bulb finding investment to keep going.

But still wouldn't explain where this arbitrary 'size limit' has come from.
 

pnewortham

Forum Patron
Patron
2 more gone today, Entice Energy and Orbit Energy.

Never heard of them.

Customers will be moved to a new supplier. So no government bailouts for these.
 

raefil

Dolly Patron
Patron
One by one the small energy businesses are disappearing whilst the multinational corporates rub their already wealthy hands together.

Another example of wealth moving upwards in Neo Liberal Britain.
 
OP
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jakehake

Preachs PA
Staff member
Patron
2 more gone today, Entice Energy and Orbit Energy.

Never heard of them.

Customers will be moved to a new supplier. So no government bailouts for these.
I’d seen Orbit on comparisons but looks like it was 60k customers or thereabouts. Some of the more midsized ones mist be quite pissed off now that Bulb was singled out.

Was trying to see how many are actually left and it’s hard to establish. Stories suggest we maybe left with the big 6 and a couple of challengers. The issue now is that almost no one is going to trust that any small or new company is going to be able to stay in business. If x million people go through the hassle of being with a failed provider it feels it will put people off going through that process in future even if they save a few quid(which is a shame as people giving the big companies a shoeing was part for the appeal)
 

pnewortham

Forum Patron
Patron
I’d seen Orbit on comparisons but looks like it was 60k customers or thereabouts. Some of the more midsized ones mist be quite pissed off now that Bulb was singled out.

Was trying to see how many are actually left and it’s hard to establish. Stories suggest we maybe left with the big 6 and a couple of challengers. The issue now is that almost no one is going to trust that any small or new company is going to be able to stay in business. If x million people go through the hassle of being with a failed provider it feels it will put people off going through that process in future even if they save a few quid(which is a shame as people giving the big companies a shoeing was part for the appeal)

As long as my money is guaranteed, via the regulators, then I'd happily jump across to any small outfit if the rates were good. No qualms at all.
 
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jakehake

Preachs PA
Staff member
Patron
As long as my money is guaranteed, via the regulators, then I'd happily jump across to any small outfit if the rates were good. No qualms at all.

Likewise, but I think we'd be the exceptions rather than the norms, I imagine for a lot of people stability and not having to faff around or worrying that their money is lost(even though it isn't) is probably what drives the inertia of those who stay within the big 6 or even with their original supplier still. Seeing all these small ones fail probably won't help the confidence levels if you move away(once it starts costing the Government money you wonder whether we can expect an FSCS £85k cap where your credit balance would be protected up to a limit, I bet your debt limit wouldn't be capped mind you)
 

pnewortham

Forum Patron
Patron
Likewise, but I think we'd be the exceptions rather than the norms, I imagine for a lot of people stability and not having to faff around or worrying that their money is lost(even though it isn't) is probably what drives the inertia of those who stay within the big 6 or even with their original supplier still. Seeing all these small ones fail probably won't help the confidence levels if you move away(once it starts costing the Government money you wonder whether we can expect an FSCS £85k cap where your credit balance would be protected up to a limit, I bet your debt limit wouldn't be capped mind you)

Interesting point about the price cap. Depends how much they value a true market economy I suppose.

As for moving away, I'm just a geek who loves spreadsheets. Perhaps we should set up a Google Drive to compare notes. 🤓
 

Sepp Blatter

Liz Truss Groupie
Patron
I’d seen Orbit on comparisons but looks like it was 60k customers or thereabouts. Some of the more midsized ones mist be quite pissed off now that Bulb was singled out.

Was trying to see how many are actually left and it’s hard to establish. Stories suggest we maybe left with the big 6 and a couple of challengers. The issue now is that almost no one is going to trust that any small or new company is going to be able to stay in business. If x million people go through the hassle of being with a failed provider it feels it will put people off going through that process in future even if they save a few quid(which is a shame as people giving the big companies a shoeing was part for the appeal)

Interesting point about the price cap. Depends how much they value a true market economy I suppose.

As for moving away, I'm just a geek who loves spreadsheets. Perhaps we should set up a Google Drive to compare notes. 🤓
The problem is that the whole model is faulty - trying to introduce false competition into natural monopolies through market liberalisation encourages speculation. That's one of the reasons they introduced regulators and price caps because free markets don't work for electricity - it's all a bit of a fudge.

In future years, giving the big companies a shoeing is going to be more about supporting local energy projects and producers. In the medium term, it is likely that your electricity bill is going to include more and more fixed charges anyway as we shift to renewable energy and smart systems.
 
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