VAR 2019

Regardless

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So... both Champions' League quarter finals were decided by a very late VAR penalty tonight.

Obviously the Manure game was dramatic and, to be honest, I'm glad they won. But was that really handball? Obviously I see If a defender turns his back and gets hit on the back of the arm... was it really a "Clear and obvious error" ** by the on-field referee? (** assuming this is still the definition that's used).

I'd be livid if I was a PSG fan.... much much more livid than if the onfield ref had given the pen, and VAR was not involved.
 

raefil

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Uniteds claim for the penalty werent even half hearted, I was surprised it was called back, even more surprised it was given.
 

Regardless

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Uniteds claim for the penalty werent even half hearted, I was surprised it was called back, even more surprised it was given.
[Looks like I was tired when I cobbled together that OP... but you got the gist!]

I only saw the incident once on ITV news last night... so didn't know that. Did you get the impression that the ref had seen it come off the defender's arm and decided it was not a pen? Or did the ref look to the VAR? Or maybe you got the impression that the ref thought it came of the defender's back?
 

Worthington

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No way is that a penalty. They might as well tie defenders arms to their bodies if they're going to start giving handball for that.

Nice One.
 

wld

First Team
According to the laws of the game (which include the additional guidance to referees) - it’s probably not a penalty. According to the guidance VAR operators have been given for the European Cup, it’s definitely a penalty. The biggest factor is the VAR guidance that states (I paraphrase a little) if a player makes himself bigger by extending their body position with their arms it’s a penalty.

The VAR conditions should state they’ll use the laws of the game when enforcing decisions - but they don’t. I would also add that when ex players like Hargreaves and Owen sit in their studio pontificating that you only undertsand the game when you’ve played I do tend to rail against them - get involved in the game, become a referee, advise the authorities instead of taking huge salaries for talking for a few minutes.
 

pnematic

Manager
So if a defender jumps up in the wall ( in the box) at a free kick and the ball strikes his elbow - it’s a penalty?

This is overthinking - it’s either intentional handball or accidental handball.

The authorities would be better stamping out the wrestling match in the box at every corner - there’s currently a dozen blatant penalties in each game !
 

raefil

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[Looks like I was tired when I cobbled together that OP... but you got the gist!]

I only saw the incident once on ITV news last night... so didn't know that. Did you get the impression that the ref had seen it come off the defender's arm and decided it was not a pen? Or did the ref look to the VAR? Or maybe you got the impression that the ref thought it came of the defender's back?
He gave a corner, it was as the corner was about be taken when he obviously got the message to check.
 

Tino

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He gave a corner, it was as the corner was about be taken when he obviously got the message to check.
And as soon as he gets a message to go and check I think it's clear he was going to award the penalty.
 

Doc Brown

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The decision to award United a penalty was absolutely ridiculous.

I don't think the strike was even on target.
 

norfolk white

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The ref also took so long to make a decision whilst looking at the VAR screen that he wasn't 100% sure and therefore, was he right to give the penalty?
 

Worthington

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As the pundits said last night to the BT Sport in house referee, "you need to speak to some footballers."
They're absolutely right. Footballers/Ex-footballers should be invited to help the refs association out. Also there should be a recruitment drive in the lower divisions from all nations ie: footballers who still need to make a living, to promote ex-footballers to become referees. It's abundantly clear in most games that the bastard in the black has never played football in his life.

Nice One.
 

Regardless

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It will be put down as "once we get better at implementing it, VAR will be great".

Will it bollcks.

I'm sure I heard that one of Tuesday's QFs was held up for an age whilst they checked that the ball hadn't gone out of play before being played in for someone to score... supporters unsure if it's going to be a goal or not. And in just searching for that, I found this report from the first leg of the Ajax-Madrid match.

But Nicolas Tagliafico's header was controversially ruled out, the first instance of VAR being used in Champions League history and a worrying sign that much of what is to come surrounding video replays might end up being tiresome debate that solves nothing.
 

Tino

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As the pundits said last night to the BT Sport in house referee, "you need to speak to some footballers."
They're absolutely right. Footballers/Ex-footballers should be invited to help the refs association out. Also there should be a recruitment drive in the lower divisions from all nations ie: footballers who still need to make a living, to promote ex-footballers to become referees. It's abundantly clear in most games that the bastard in the black has never played football in his life.

Nice One.
Sounds like a decent idea, though there would be a problem with footballers and ex footballers not actually knowing the laws of the game. The PSG manager was even saying it shouldn't have been given as the shot was off target.
 

paddysr

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I thought it was harsh but the player turned his back. Had he not done that and the ball had struck him in the same way I don't think it would have been given.
 

Regardless

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I thought it was harsh but the player turned his back. Had he not done that and the ball had struck him in the same way I don't think it would have been given.
Surely if the player had stayed facing the ball and it struck him the same way, there would be MORE justification for giving it? Even then, I doubt it.

I've seen it again now - and it looked a more ridiculous decision than I first thought last night. The ball was struck really firmly (I don't blame him for turning his back!) and hit him in an instant.

This is exactly how I (and many more) foresaw VAR would work out. SOME errors are cleared up.. but when they get it wrong, with all the benefits of replay technology, it is such a massive travesty of justice that it outweighs the more numerous occasions in which it correctly overturns a decision. And on top of that, there's all the waiting around to see if you can celebrate a goal.
 

Jack Daniels

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The decision to award United a penalty was absolutely ridiculous.

I don't think the strike was even on target.
If I am running/turning/twisting away from goal in the penalty area and I get clipped/fouled/dragged down, it is still a penalty.

Whilst I understand those who say it wasn't a penalty, if you watch the slow mo replays (as I did last night on BT), you'll clearly see the defender look at the ball for 1, maybe 2 seconds thus knowing where the ball was, he then turns and STILL puts his arm out. Dalot (United RB) immediately claims "handball" whilst the Ref gives a corner.

Clearly, there was enough of a legitimate issue for VAR to call it back. Good decision and it is one in the eye for PSG who thought they had the tie in the bag. Bonus fun to be had watching Neymars pitch side tantrums. 😂

The blame lies with the defender. He clearly saw that the shot probably wasn't initially on target yet he still led with arm at around 8ft in the air.

Dimwit.

Well done Rashford (same for Kane the previous night). We should be celebrating that two of Englands top strikers are now beginning to show nerves of steel at key key moments - away from home - in pressure cooker atmospheres.

Lets hope that City join Spurs and United into the QFs. Well done to both Ajax and Porto, too.
 

Ron Burgundy

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Penalty for me.

Their player has jumped and his arm has come out to stop a shot on goal, that's gaining an advantage for me.

If their player hadn't jumped and it hit his arm then you can understand.

Also if the player was on the line stopping the shot going in everyone would say it is a penalty.
 
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