UK Politics

raefil said:
The SNP have been very consistent on their stance over Israel. Starmer has flip flopped all the way through.
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They have also been consistent in their view of the U.K Parliament. Unfortunately, the world is becoming polarised and history tells us this makes the world a very dangerous place. I vowed when I joined this forum to stay clear of politics and I've failed, but I wish we could walk in the shoes of others, on all sides of the political / economic spectrum.
 
Regardless said:
Not happy with Starmer - but I think it totally fanciful to think that his non selection/ re-election was used as a threat. Absolute total bullshit rumour that’s gone viral IMO.
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Hadn't really though of it before you and S asked the question but maybe you are both right. It would be easy to just throw that out there for the SNP and Tories. Has he just been too diplomatic? It's a possibility.

Still stand by the opinion I'd love him to go. We need more force in that seat. Politics in this country has gone backwards. Needs a totally new broom in that chair. I would even go as far as forcing the PM to answer his questions on Wednesdays. If he makes no attempt,you can pull him up on that.

And he never makes an attempt
 
Durutti said:
Hadn't really though of it before you and S asked the question but maybe you are both right. It would be easy to just throw that out there for the SNP and Tories. Has he just been too diplomatic? It's a possibility.

Still stand by the opinion I'd love him to go. We need more force in that seat. Politics in this country has gone backwards. Needs a totally new broom in that chair. I would even go as far as forcing the PM to answer his questions on Wednesdays. If he makes no attempt,you can pull him up on that.

And he never makes an attempt
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When he threatens MPs with expulsion for the umpteenth time, its like they're being thrashed with a bunch of feather dusters. Total wet Truss.
 
Portishead said:
When he threatens MPs with expulsion for the umpteenth time, its like they're being thrashed with a bunch of feather dusters. Total wet Truss.
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I honestly think he would do well to sit down with a couple of teachers and get some tips. The first one would be, like you say, stop threatening, start doing.
 
Portishead said:
Time is the enemy of the truth and what actually happened. Its easy to re-rehearse, retrench and gain traction for claims that at the time were dismantled as either untrue or unreasonably based. Everyone's memories fade unless I guess you were on the frontline. I wasn't thankfully but my thinking is that my GP is more likely to provide me with the best advice rather than a blog or a letters page.
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Wasn’t on the front line, GP Surgery. But the pressure from patients who were clamouring for the jab was pretty bad, and when it was announced that carers could get it, the number of “carers” went through the roof.
 
We8PNE said:
I disagree. He's made a mistake, which he's acknowledged. A thourghourly decent politician.
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Today (yesterday) lunchtime’s Politics Live had a good panel and was a really good edition. Respectful, intelligent interesting debate.

One thought-provoking (contentious) comment came from a youngish guy from the Telegraph (can’t remember his name). After everyone else had praised Hoyle for making his long and sincere apology, he said something to the effect of…

“Actually, I think he was wrong to apologise. Having realised his mistake, he should have publicly stood firm- just told everyone that he made his decision and everyone just get on with it.” “You should not be too nice when you’re Speaker of the HoC and Hoyle is too nice”.

Not convinced he’s right with that idea. But I am not convinced he’s wrong!
 
Mr S said:
I really don't think it's Hoyle who is trying to save his job. The SNP present a divisive motion intended to cause a division within the Labour ranks, thereby maximising their chances of being re elected in Scotland. The Conservative Party present a motion, that further polarises the issue, intended to maximise the damage to the Labour Party., thereby maximising their chances of being re=elected. Call me naive, but this was never about a grown up debate into the Israeli / Palestine conflict it was one big charade to protect personal interests. Sadly, a good and honourable man will do the honourable thing and resign.
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None of it has much to do with Israel and palestine, it's mostly party political point scoring and virtue signalling left wingers making a noise. A noise far greater than they do for any other conflict.

The fact a nationalist party has such an influence over the rest of the UK, who they wish to devolve from completely, is horrific.
 
Snickiwi said:
None of it has much to do with Israel and palestine, it's mostly party political point scoring and virtue signalling left wingers making a noise. A noise far greater than they do for any other conflict.

The fact a nationalist party has such an influence over the rest of the UK, who they wish to devolve from completely, is horrific.
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No it's not, it's democracy. It's hardly horrific to not want to be part of the UK. Half the time I fucking don't.
 
Snickiwi said:
Move then if you hate it that and are ashamed of it that much.

How is it democratic that a party that was formed to campaign against the very institutions where it sits with influence?
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Because it's democratic. Being part of the house of commons doesn't mean you agree with everything the UK stands for, just that you were elected by voters to represent them.

I'm stuck here due to looking after elderly family members.

If you make the UK less shit then you obliterate the SNP.

The fact many Scots want to rejoin the EU and single market (and they voted to do so in a referendum but weren't heard) is a strong enough reason to want to leave the UK.
 
Durutti said:
Because it's democratic. Being part of the house of commons doesn't mean you agree with everything the UK stands for, just that you were elected by voters to represent them.

I'm stuck here due to looking after elderly family members.

If you make the UK less shit then you obliterate the SNP.

The fact many Scots want to rejoin the EU and single market (and they voted to do so in a referendum but weren't heard) is a strong enough reason to want to leave the UK.
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Im not sure how you can leave the UK democratically without representation in the UKs parliament. Most Scots have spotted long ago that the UK system is skewed and favours the metropolis. The red wall voters have learnt the hard way that voting in the very SE leaning tories is like turkeys voting for Xmas.
 
We8PNE said:
I disagree. He's made a mistake, which he's acknowledged. A thourghourly decent politician.
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I tend to agree, the problem is about trust, going forward.

I feel hes been used by starmer a thoroughly untrustworthy politician
 
Durutti said:
Because it's democratic. Being part of the house of commons doesn't mean you agree with everything the UK stands for, just that you were elected by voters to represent them.

I'm stuck here due to looking after elderly family members.

If you make the UK less shit then you obliterate the SNP.

The fact many Scots want to rejoin the EU and single market (and they voted to do so in a referendum but weren't heard) is a strong enough reason to want to leave the UK.
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At least they have their own unique representation. The English don’t.


As for hating the U.K. half the time…be very careful where you move to then.
 
Dirty Harry said:
Michael Gove accepted hospitality (including a QPR match) from a firm who were then awarded £146m PPE contract. He broke the law as he didn't declare it, claims he forgot to do so, but 'thanks the Guardian for bringing it to his attention'.
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The poor bastard having to go to a QPR match to make a few quid, or maybe get a fix.
 
Struggle to grasp this Hoyle hyperbole on many levels

Despite my user name I no longer live in Chorley, but used to , and have family who do, and by all accounts he is a very decent chap, regardless of politics. Always had a soft spot for him as some of my southern based customers say he talks like me 🙂

He has admitted he has made a mistake, he has apologised, he seems quite sincere in that, so why cant we just move on? The world hasnt ended. Much rather people admit to mistakes instead of trying to excuse them - far less likely to do the same again - in fact he will be incredibly careful not to

Whlist MPs are not mine ,or most people's, cup of tea, I do symathise with the crap they have to put up with. We have unfortunately imported the Middle East problems in to this country, and all the lunatics, religous fruitcakes, and death threats that go with it. MPs are in the firing line. He has a genuine concern for them and I accept that was part of his , albeit wrong, reasoning

Much of this surrounds pointless signalling about what the British House of Commons thinks should happen in Gaza. Like the Palestinians or Israelis give 2 shits what 600 MPS, many of whom are freaks anyway, think. They are just focussed in obliterating as much of the other side as they can

lastly - the previous speaker, a Tory, spent most of the latter part of his tenure trying to overturn a democratic decision of the people of this country, was blatantly biased in his selection of amendments etc , and was not by any stretch of the imagination a decent man. Despite his corruption, he survived , yet Hoyle makes one slip up and he's threatened with being ousted. It stinks
 
chorleythehord said:
Struggle to grasp this Hoyle hyperbole on many levels

Despite my user name I no longer live in Chorley, but used to , and have family who do, and by all accounts he is a very decent chap, regardless of politics. Always had a soft spot for him as some of my southern based customers say he talks like me 🙂

He has admitted he has made a mistake, he has apologised, he seems quite sincere in that, so why cant we just move on? The world hasnt ended. Much rather people admit to mistakes instead of trying to excuse them - far less likely to do the same again - in fact he will be incredibly careful not to

Whlist MPs are not mine ,or most people's, cup of tea, I do symathise with the crap they have to put up with. We have unfortunately imported the Middle East problems in to this country, and all the lunatics, religous fruitcakes, and death threats that go with it. MPs are in the firing line. He has a genuine concern for them and I accept that was part of his , albeit wrong, reasoning

Much of this surrounds pointless signalling about what the British House of Commons thinks should happen in Gaza. Like the Palestinians or Israelis give 2 shits what 600 MPS, many of whom are freaks anyway, think. They are just focussed in obliterating as much of the other side as they can

lastly - the previous speaker, a Tory, spent most of the latter part of his tenure trying to overturn a democratic decision of the people of this country, was blatantly biased in his selection of amendments etc , and was not by any stretch of the imagination a decent man. Despite his corruption, he survived , yet Hoyle makes one slip up and he's threatened with being ousted. It stinks
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Jo cox was murdered by A British far right White supremacist.

Other than that I agree with a good amount you say.

Theres a big difference between people protesting peacefully outside parliament than the far right white supremacist and the extreme Islamist who murdered 2 MPs.

In fact since the war 5 MPs have been killed 3 by the IRA and 2 mentioned above.
 
raefil said:
Jo cox was murdered by A British far right White supremacist.

Other than that I agree with a good amount you say.

Theres a big difference between people protesting peacefully outside parliament than the far right white supremacist and the extreme Islamist who murdered 2 MPs.

In fact since the war 5 MPs have been killed 3 by the IRA and 2 mentioned above.
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The sums don’t quite add up, if I am reading that right. Apart from the 3 killed by the IRA, you seen to mention 3 others. Just out of interest, do you know the exact situation?
 
chorleythehord said:
Struggle to grasp this Hoyle hyperbole on many levels

Despite my user name I no longer live in Chorley, but used to , and have family who do, and by all accounts he is a very decent chap, regardless of politics. Always had a soft spot for him as some of my southern based customers say he talks like me 🙂

He has admitted he has made a mistake, he has apologised, he seems quite sincere in that, so why cant we just move on? The world hasnt ended. Much rather people admit to mistakes instead of trying to excuse them - far less likely to do the same again - in fact he will be incredibly careful not to

Whlist MPs are not mine ,or most people's, cup of tea, I do symathise with the crap they have to put up with. We have unfortunately imported the Middle East problems in to this country, and all the lunatics, religous fruitcakes, and death threats that go with it. MPs are in the firing line. He has a genuine concern for them and I accept that was part of his , albeit wrong, reasoning

Much of this surrounds pointless signalling about what the British House of Commons thinks should happen in Gaza. Like the Palestinians or Israelis give 2 shits what 600 MPS, many of whom are freaks anyway, think. They are just focussed in obliterating as much of the other side as they can

lastly - the previous speaker, a Tory, spent most of the latter part of his tenure trying to overturn a democratic decision of the people of this country, was blatantly biased in his selection of amendments etc , and was not by any stretch of the imagination a decent man. Despite his corruption, he survived , yet Hoyle makes one slip up and he's threatened with being ousted. It stinks
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The guy from the Telegraph that I paraquoted* earlier made the comparison with Bercow when suggesting that it’s better not to apologise too much when you’re in the chair. In real life, people have more respect for a decisive chair than a flip-flopper - even if the kinder chair might be a nicer person 😉

*not actually a word- but it should be!
 
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