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Ukraine-Russia Conflict

Where does the gibbon get his democratic authority to go round non Nato countries (Sweden in this case) pledging unqualified military support on request. Making up stuff on the spot. Bet the military command has kittens every time he steps off his Voyager plane overseas. Not to mention our soldiers and families.
 
Portishead said:
Where does the gibbon get his democratic authority to go round non Nato countries (Sweden in this case) pledging unqualified military support on request. Making up stuff on the spot. Bet the military command has kittens every time he steps off his Voyager plane overseas. Not to mention our soldiers and families.
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You`re forgetting that both are part of the Joint Expeditionay Force, which to be fair has slipped under the radar of many, and has become more important..MUCH more important...since the invasion of Ukraine.

en.wikipedia.org

UK Joint Expeditionary Force - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
Bardas said:
You`re forgetting that both are part of the Joint Expeditionay Force, which to be fair has slipped under the radar of many, and has become more important..MUCH more important...since the invasion of Ukraine.

en.wikipedia.org

UK Joint Expeditionary Force - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
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I wasnt aware that the JEF was underpinned with the same principle that NATO regarding an attack on one being considered an attack on all. Johnson seems to have just guaranteed Sweden something not far short. He’s presumptuous that he has a democratic mandate to go round Europe unconditionally committing our troops to future engagement. I wonder when hes going to consult Parliament.
 
Bardas said:
Stone and Putin are buddies from way back, he`s simply repeating Kremlin propaganda.

www.polygraph.info

Misleading: Oliver Stone’s Speculation About a False-Flag Nuclear Attack in Ukraine

The U.S. has tried to tamp down Russia’s veiled threats about using nuclear weapons against Ukraine.
www.polygraph.info www.polygraph.info
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Yes, as much as I am a believer in free speech, the internet is a dangerous place and somewhere to be treated with great caution.. It gives a forum for nutcases to spread their propaganda on blogs and the like. As I noted , one or two points that are at least half truths to gain credibility, followed by complete tripe, that people copy, forward etc.
 
Portishead said:
I wasnt aware that the JEF was underpinned with the same principle that NATO regarding an attack on one being considered an attack on all. Johnson seems to have just guaranteed Sweden something not far short. He’s presumptuous that he has a democratic mandate to go round Europe unconditionally committing our troops to future engagement. I wonder when hes going to consult Parliament.
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Finland too, pretty much. ( Ref..Ben Wallace, a week ago)

Parliament will rubber stamp it anyway, the UK have long pivoted towards the Baltics and Northern Europe, and will be playing a much larger role there, as the Lead Nation ,after Ukraine anyway, within the NATO command structure.

The JEF nations are naturally also likely to play a lead role in any future defence of Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia too, if things get that far.

Sweden is the least of your worries, mate. :)
 
Bardas said:
Finland too, pretty much. ( Ref..Ben Wallace, a week ago)

Parliament will rubber stamp it anyway, the UK have long pivoted towards the Baltics and Northern Europe, and will be playing a much larger role there, as the Lead Nation ,after Ukraine anyway, within the NATO command structure.

The JEF nations are naturally also likely to play a lead role in any future defence of Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia too, if things get that far.

Sweden is the least of your worries, mate. :)
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My worry is having a dolt in charge going off half cock. Hes a loose cannon no-one needs in a time of tension. Your assumption regarding rubber stamping is an assumption. Theres plenty on Johnsons right that might not be so keen to be drawn into a full scale war brought on by a ramping up of language by Biggles, driven to save his political skin. Its reasonable to assume if hes clueless at governing, hes clueless when it comes to committing our troops to battle.
 
Well maybe the Swedes should try discussing with the Poles British assurances. As for Boris what he's doing is simply moving with the times and the new and still forming geo political landscape of Europe. During the cold war Europe was the centre of the global geo political landscape. The cold war ended, the middle east ended up being the new centre of global geo politics. And I think some in Europe had a peculiar sense of loss about that. A loss of importance so to speak.

But here we are, full circle, back to the old state of affairs and trying to shuffle into formation in a quickly moving landscape. I expect many others to make the same statement Boris has, in time. It's not altruism, it's necessity.
 
JFK-1 said:

But here we are, full circle, back to the old state of affairs and trying to shuffle into formation in a quickly moving landscape. I expect many others to make the same statement Boris has, in time. It's not altruism, it's necessity.
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There are times in my (long) life when I`ve felt profoundly embarassed, as someone who is British, by our prime Minister, to the point of being ashamed of my country and the people that voted the government in.

Thatcher, Blair, now Johnson, an opportunist power-seeker that pretended he believed in Brexit in order to become PM, putting his personal ambition before his country. Threatening to suspend parliament. Partygate.The list goes on.

So yes, the world has changed. Changed so much, and so rapidly, that on the world stage the UK and Boris, however unpalatable and unlikely it may be, are playing an absolute blinder.

PS, JFK....regarding your final two sentences, the process has already begun with other nordic nations, such as Denmark.
 
Bardas said:
There are times in my (long) life when I`ve felt profoundly embarassed, as someone who is British, by our prime Minister, to the point of being ashamed of my country and the people that voted the government in.

Thatcher, Blair, now Johnson, an opportunist power-seeker that pretended he believed in Brexit in order to become PM, putting his personal ambition before his country. Threatening to suspend parliament. Partygate.The list goes on.

So yes, the world has changed. Changed so much, and so rapidly, that on the world stage the UK and Boris, however unpalatable and unlikely it may be, are playing an absolute blinder.

PS, JFK....regarding your final two sentences, the process has already begun with other nordic nations, such as Denmark.
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Youre confusing the UK stage with the world stage. Politically, Johnson has relegated UK to the periphery and his tub thumping is merely trying to recover some relevance. Johnson is doing what Johnson always does. Bluster and hollow grand promises to people in need. Words. In his element. He will remain untouched and others, in this case the AF, will pick up the pieces.
 
Bardas said:
PS, JFK....regarding your final two sentences, the process has already begun with other nordic nations, such as Denmark.
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The irony is staggering. Putin, master strategist, declares he's invading Ukraine basically because they're real friendly with the West, and might join NATO which in reality wasn't even on the cards.

The likes of Sweden and Finland weren't interested in joining NATO. Most of their population didn't want it. Now over 90% of them do want it for obvious reasons and they're likely to get it before this year is out.

So the master strategist created a situation in which he has effectively engineered his own encirclement by NATO. Go Putin, strategist for the ages. That's his legacy. Alongside the looming basket case of an economy.
 
Portishead said:
Youre confusing the UK stage with the world stage. Politically, Johnson has relegated UK to the periphery and his tub thumping is merely trying to recover some relevance. Johnson is doing what Johnson always does. Bluster and hollow grand promises to people in need. Words. In his element. He will remain untouched and others, in this case the AF, will pick up the pieces.
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If Britain has been relegated to the periphery why does Putin seem angrier with the UK than any other country? Is it because we matter more than the rest of Europe?

If Britain has been relegated to the periphery why does Eastern Europe look to Britain for military help? Why don't they look to other EU members?

If Britain has been relegated to the periphery why does the EU still seem so concerned about the things we do? Is it because we are still a large economy?

We may indeed not be as important and powerful as we once were but that has nothing to do with Boris or leaving the EU - an organisation we should have joined right at the start or never at all.

Bardas may well be confusing the UK stage with the world stage - you're words not mine - but I think you are confusing the UK with the Federated States of Micronesia.

If Britain has to fight a war, and it may well come to that, it is better that the fighting is done elsewhere and not on our green and pleasant land.
 
Portishead said:
Youre confusing the UK stage with the world stage. Politically, Johnson has relegated UK to the periphery and his tub thumping is merely trying to recover some relevance. Johnson is doing what Johnson always does. Bluster and hollow grand promises to people in need. Words. In his element. He will remain untouched and others, in this case the AF, will pick up the pieces.
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Sorry, mate..I can fully understand why you think that, but it`s totally untrue. You have to read the foreign press and follow events from an international viewpoint to see the bigger picture. Diplomatic pages , the European press, and US coverage can be valuable in this regard..although obviously it needs some balance by checking India, South Africa, the Middle East etc.

As someone who ( understandably) wants Boris gone....I`m afraid this is your worst nightmare...Ukraine is strengthening his position immensely, and distracting from other failings...no matter how much you might prefer it to be otherwise.
 
Well with no disrespect to Sweden i'm sure we would all rather fight a war there than here. Britain is only diminished in the sense that she's no longer a superpower but is still a nuclear armed great power with a relatively large population and a large technologically advanced economy which in 2022 is the 4th biggest military spender in the world. https://www.globalfirepower.com/country-military-strength-detail.php?country_id=united-kingdom

If the British army and in fact all British military branches were in Ukraine right now fighting an all out conventional war against that army Putin has in there it would be close to a desert storm type rout. And that's just Britain not NATO. I can just picture SAS units alone feasting on convoys stuck in mud, out of petrol, and Generals flocking around.

Putin is a conventional military pygmy in comparison to NATO. Just one stat is NATO 28,000 combat aircraft, Putin 5,000.

China would struggle against NATO far less Putin.
 
pnesaint said:
If Britain has been relegated to the periphery why does Putin seem angrier with the UK than any other country? Is it because we matter more than the rest of Europe?

If Britain has been relegated to the periphery why does Eastern Europe look to Britain for military help? Why don't they look to other EU members?

If Britain has been relegated to the periphery why does the EU still seem so concerned about the things we do? Is it because we are still a large economy?

We may indeed not be as important and powerful as we once were but that has nothing to do with Boris or leaving the EU - an organisation we should have joined right at the start or never at all.

Bardas may well be confusing the UK stage with the world stage - you're words not mine - but I think you are confusing the UK with the Federated States of Micronesia.

If Britain has to fight a war, and it may well come to that, it is better that the fighting is done elsewhere and not on our green and pleasant land.
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Indeed - as pointed out previously, the UK still rates highly for soft power and isn't too shabby on hard power, either (although criticisms of the government cutting capabilities too far are valid, IMO).

Never was sure where this idea that the UK is an irrelevance has come from - maybe it is because I am looking more from the outside and can see that it isn't true.
 
Another feature of this is Britain has 2 universities in the top 5 of the worlds best universities. That is of course Oxford and Cambridge, the other 3 in the top 5 are all American. This is what gives the US in particular a technological edge, alongside the fact they pump a lot of money into research.

Russia universities on the other hand are a joke in comparison. The highest ranking Uni they have comes in at 194, that's Lomonosov Moscow State University.
 
Bardas said:
Sorry, mate..I can fully understand why you think that, but it`s totally untrue. You have to read the foreign press and follow events from an international viewpoint to see the bigger picture. Diplomatic pages , the European press, and US coverage can be valuable in this regard..although obviously it needs some balance by checking India, South Africa, the Middle East etc.

As someone who ( understandably) wants Boris gone....I`m afraid this is your worst nightmare...Ukraine is strengthening his position immensely, and distracting from other failings...no matter how much you might prefer it to be otherwise.
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We are given this impression that other major countries are obsessed with us. Having lived over a decade in both France and Germany, it just aint true. Much like the US, they are fascinated with our royalty. But we are most definitely not the centre of their world. Whenever we have national death or other event, our media would have us believe there are miliions watching in awe. It just isnt true Im afraid. I dont know which overseas papers/sites you are reading if you think they are headlining Brexit or Boris. Not the major ones I peruse
 
Portishead said:
We are given this impression that other major countries are obsessed with us. Having lived over a decade in both France and Germany, it just aint true. Much like the US, they are fascinated with our royalty. But we are most definitely not the centre of their world. Whenever we have national death or other event, our media would have us believe there are miliions watching in awe. It just isnt true Im afraid. I dont know which overseas papers/sites you are reading if you think they are headlining Brexit or Boris. Not the major ones I peruse
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Wakey wakey...we`re not on the Brexit or Royalty threads. And whenever your decade in Europe was, it didn`t take place over the last few months.

I`m talking about Ukraine and handling of it since, very specifically.

And whatever you read, quite frankly, given the tone of your recent replies which have been to shoot the messenger, and unnecessarily confrontational despite my friendly approach, I`ll say what I think, which is that you don`t half talk shit.
 
Bardas said:
Wakey wakey...we`re not on the Brexit or Royalty threads. And whenever your decade in Europe was, it didn`t take place over the last few months.

I`m talking about Ukraine and handling of it since, very specifically.

And whatever you read, quite frankly, given the tone of your recent replies which have been to shoot the messenger, and unnecessarily confrontational despite my friendly approach, I`ll say what I think, which is that you don`t half talk shit.
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Im sensing pot and kettle. Disagreeing is not being confrontational. Calling someone 'mate' is rather.
 
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